<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0" xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom" xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/" > <channel><title>Comments on: Why I Quit Facebook, And Why Wineries Should As Well</title> <atom:link href="http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" /><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/</link> <description>A blog about starting and building a family winery in the Russian River Valley.</description> <lastBuildDate>Tue, 18 Oct 2011 15:58:42 +0000</lastBuildDate> <sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod> <sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency> <generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1</generator> <item><title>By: John Dale</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251845</link> <dc:creator>John Dale</dc:creator> <pubDate>Wed, 26 May 2010 13:22:04 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251845</guid> <description>This is an interesting micro-media discussion u have here. I make paintings of birds and grapes for a living, usually with birds chosen for their color, not because of any intrinsic relation to pinot noirs, for example. So I have an avid interest in the postings of photos on wine blogs, winery websites, etc., especially during harvest, as photos posted give me all the info I need about the structure and disposition of the vines, the leaves and the grape clusters. Facebook as a source material is sometimes more interesting since people&#039;s comments are often quite informative. So, I get info from winery owners and enthusiasts in a way that is sponotaneous and usually to the point, especially in terms of what too much rain did, pruning issues, leaf management, etc. So, I love this virally transmitted info. However, if it were done in manner that is more like the one way tv media or spam, that would be different. I welcome wineries presence on FB since I can ask questions like why don&#039;t all wineries use netting to protect from birds, how much spraying w/ pesticides is done, how does leaf management take place in their climate, what characteristics is the grower wanting in their Merlot, etc., not to mention getting to know something about the owners. This is not all bad. Guarding from predatory business people and abusers is a must, but that&#039;s the nature of all Internet experience, n&#039;est-ce pas? Anyway, when I have learned enough, it has led me to order a case or two, maybe three, sometimes four ...</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is an interesting micro-media discussion u have here. I make paintings of birds and grapes for a living, usually with birds chosen for their color, not because of any intrinsic relation to pinot noirs, for example. So I have an avid interest in the postings of photos on wine blogs, winery websites, etc., especially during harvest, as photos posted give me all the info I need about the structure and disposition of the vines, the leaves and the grape clusters. Facebook as a source material is sometimes more interesting since people&#8217;s comments are often quite informative. So, I get info from winery owners and enthusiasts in a way that is sponotaneous and usually to the point, especially in terms of what too much rain did, pruning issues, leaf management, etc. So, I love this virally transmitted info. However, if it were done in manner that is more like the one way tv media or spam, that would be different. I welcome wineries presence on FB since I can ask questions like why don&#8217;t all wineries use netting to protect from birds, how much spraying w/ pesticides is done, how does leaf management take place in their climate, what characteristics is the grower wanting in their Merlot, etc., not to mention getting to know something about the owners. This is not all bad. Guarding from predatory business people and abusers is a must, but that&#8217;s the nature of all Internet experience, n&#8217;est-ce pas? Anyway, when I have learned enough, it has led me to order a case or two, maybe three, sometimes four &#8230;</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Josh</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251844</link> <dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 25 May 2010 17:29:58 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251844</guid> <description>Ryan,There is no protection. And I have no trust that future &quot;fixes&quot; will remedy this. Further Facebook should not be rewarded for bad behavior.And what exactly are brands losing by not being on Facebook? A few sales. Probably not even a percentage point in total direct sales.I encourage every winery to try and quantify their Facebook presence. If the benefits outweigh the costs (including the risk), stay. But I submit that to downplay the risk is pretty indefensible at this point. See below.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOEMv0S8AcAhttp://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2009/09/20/project_gaydar_an_mit_experiment_raises_new_questions_about_online_privacy/I&#039;m not here to disparage folks who are social media consultants, but you really should recognize that you are putting yourself in a pinch here if you continue to recommend Facebook to your clients without informing them of the very real risks.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ryan,</p><p>There is no protection. And I have no trust that future &#8220;fixes&#8221; will remedy this. Further Facebook should not be rewarded for bad behavior.</p><p>And what exactly are brands losing by not being on Facebook? A few sales. Probably not even a percentage point in total direct sales.</p><p>I encourage every winery to try and quantify their Facebook presence. If the benefits outweigh the costs (including the risk), stay. But I submit that to downplay the risk is pretty indefensible at this point. See below.</p><p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOEMv0S8AcA" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QOEMv0S8AcA</a></p><p><a href="http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2009/09/20/project_gaydar_an_mit_experiment_raises_new_questions_about_online_privacy/" rel="nofollow">http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/ideas/articles/2009/09/20/project_gaydar_an_mit_experiment_raises_new_questions_about_online_privacy/</a></p><p>I&#8217;m not here to disparage folks who are social media consultants, but you really should recognize that you are putting yourself in a pinch here if you continue to recommend Facebook to your clients without informing them of the very real risks.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: ryan</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251843</link> <dc:creator>ryan</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 25 May 2010 17:18:25 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251843</guid> <description>To cut one&#039;s nose of to spite the face? Is that a closer analogy?Facebook knows they have a problem, and they will either fix it or they will fall prey to someone smarter and more agressive in getting the consumers needs met. That said, I can see no way or no one who would link your presence on Facebook to a flaw in your moral or ethical character.Facebook is. It might not always be, but it is now. It&#039;s pretty harmless. Privacy be damned, we&#039;re not talking about much more then creepy ad serving practices at this point.Also would it not be more moral if you were to stay and to educate your &quot;fans&quot; about how to play safe on Facebook? Help to show them that they are able to protect themselves? Rather than run away and leave them there with a &#039;?&#039; where your account used to be? Maybe by helping them you could be taking a higher ground, than leaving them to fend for themselves?Great post. Hope you&#039;ll be at the WBC so we can have some more fun discussions! :)</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To cut one&#8217;s nose of to spite the face? Is that a closer analogy?</p><p>Facebook knows they have a problem, and they will either fix it or they will fall prey to someone smarter and more agressive in getting the consumers needs met. That said, I can see no way or no one who would link your presence on Facebook to a flaw in your moral or ethical character.</p><p>Facebook is. It might not always be, but it is now. It&#8217;s pretty harmless. Privacy be damned, we&#8217;re not talking about much more then creepy ad serving practices at this point.</p><p>Also would it not be more moral if you were to stay and to educate your &#8220;fans&#8221; about how to play safe on Facebook? Help to show them that they are able to protect themselves? Rather than run away and leave them there with a &#8216;?&#8217; where your account used to be? Maybe by helping them you could be taking a higher ground, than leaving them to fend for themselves?</p><p>Great post. Hope you&#8217;ll be at the WBC so we can have some more fun discussions! <img src='http://pinotblogger.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Robert McIntosh (@thirstforwine)</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251842</link> <dc:creator>Robert McIntosh (@thirstforwine)</dc:creator> <pubDate>Tue, 25 May 2010 16:58:07 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251842</guid> <description>Josh, I&#039;m a bit late to the conversation (I blame the London Wine Trade Fair as you posted this just as we were setting up). I have written a response on my blog - which should be easy enough to find.In summary, I have to salute the principle, but I think the conclusion is not correct.Thanks for the great conversation starter!</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Josh, I&#8217;m a bit late to the conversation (I blame the London Wine Trade Fair as you posted this just as we were setting up). I have written a response on my blog &#8211; which should be easy enough to find.</p><p>In summary, I have to salute the principle, but I think the conclusion is not correct.</p><p>Thanks for the great conversation starter!</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Dennis McDonald</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251835</link> <dc:creator>Dennis McDonald</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 17:41:21 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251835</guid> <description>This is one of the best conversations about Facebook I&#039;ve seen - congrats to all.I think it&#039;s possible to make convincing arguments on either side of the stay-or-go argument; the fact that FB has explicitly made it so difficult to control access is a tip off to me that they don&#039;t have my interests at heart. That said, one can still make the stay-or-go decision based on the weighing of views such as presented here.From a marketing perspective, though, you have to consider whether the medium itself will rub off some of its un-trustworthiness onto even its most squeaky-clean users and that you, the business using FB, may be -- unfairly -- tarred and feathered for your willingness to use the tool.Staying with Facebook says something about your reputation whether you like it or not so you have to then weigh whether the danger to your reputation is worth the risk -- and you know how &quot;easy&quot; it is to repair your reputation once it&#039;s tainted.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is one of the best conversations about Facebook I&#8217;ve seen &#8211; congrats to all.</p><p>I think it&#8217;s possible to make convincing arguments on either side of the stay-or-go argument; the fact that FB has explicitly made it so difficult to control access is a tip off to me that they don&#8217;t have my interests at heart. That said, one can still make the stay-or-go decision based on the weighing of views such as presented here.</p><p>From a marketing perspective, though, you have to consider whether the medium itself will rub off some of its un-trustworthiness onto even its most squeaky-clean users and that you, the business using FB, may be &#8212; unfairly &#8212; tarred and feathered for your willingness to use the tool.</p><p>Staying with Facebook says something about your reputation whether you like it or not so you have to then weigh whether the danger to your reputation is worth the risk &#8212; and you know how &#8220;easy&#8221; it is to repair your reputation once it&#8217;s tainted.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Josh</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251834</link> <dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 16:49:20 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251834</guid> <description>If the cost of engaging is tacitly endorsing that my peeps get spied on, count me out.You, of course, are free to come to a different conclusion.But feel free to enlighten me: if the idea of interacting on Facebook is not, at the end of a long process that includes respect, trust, commitment, follow through, and good times, the sale of a bottle of wine, what in the world is the point?And before you label that as crass, I encourage you to read through my many posts about, talks on, and classes taught on the subject of engagement on social media.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the cost of engaging is tacitly endorsing that my peeps get spied on, count me out.</p><p>You, of course, are free to come to a different conclusion.</p><p>But feel free to enlighten me: if the idea of interacting on Facebook is not, at the end of a long process that includes respect, trust, commitment, follow through, and good times, the sale of a bottle of wine, what in the world is the point?</p><p>And before you label that as crass, I encourage you to read through my many posts about, talks on, and classes taught on the subject of engagement on social media.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Chris C</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251833</link> <dc:creator>Chris C</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 16:42:23 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251833</guid> <description>Totally agree with Brent&#039;s comments. If you don&#039;t engage and control the message, it will continue to happen in isolation without your blessing. FB is a cocktail party, not a tradeshow, so act accordingly, and save SELLING for somewhere else..</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Totally agree with Brent&#8217;s comments. If you don&#8217;t engage and control the message, it will continue to happen in isolation without your blessing. FB is a cocktail party, not a tradeshow, so act accordingly, and save SELLING for somewhere else..</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Josh</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251832</link> <dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 15:33:47 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251832</guid> <description>You&#039;ll do what&#039;s best for your brand, of course.Just make sure you count the costs, including the risk.If the benefits outweigh the costs, stay. I submit, however, that you aren&#039;t properly counting the costs if a few sales here and there are enough to get you to stay.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;ll do what&#8217;s best for your brand, of course.</p><p>Just make sure you count the costs, including the risk.</p><p>If the benefits outweigh the costs, stay. I submit, however, that you aren&#8217;t properly counting the costs if a few sales here and there are enough to get you to stay.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Kerri Cooper</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251831</link> <dc:creator>Kerri Cooper</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 15:21:06 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251831</guid> <description>I have to agree with Robin. Our winery sells direct to consumer and Facebook has been a great way for us to round out our communications with customers and fans. Keeps them in the loop regularly. I don&#039;t look at FB as the end all to marketing our wines but it is a nice addition. Just last week I posted a special on wines and had fantastic response that resulted in a great week of sales:)</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to agree with Robin. Our winery sells direct to consumer and Facebook has been a great way for us to round out our communications with customers and fans. Keeps them in the loop regularly. I don&#8217;t look at FB as the end all to marketing our wines but it is a nice addition. Just last week I posted a special on wines and had fantastic response that resulted in a great week of sales:)</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> <item><title>By: Josh</title><link>http://pinotblogger.com/2010/05/17/why-i-quit-facebook-and-why-every-winery-should-as-well/comment-page-1/#comment-251830</link> <dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator> <pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 15:07:03 +0000</pubDate> <guid isPermaLink="false">http://pinotblogger.com/?p=1528#comment-251830</guid> <description>Or you could make it an event. I won&#039;t insult you by going into too much detail, but a 10 day countdown before you quite educating them as to why, with special deals and tie-in events at the tasting room. You could also pepper each announcement with links to the ways your peeps can reach you outside of Facebook, like Twitter, your blog, posterous etc.You can achieve the same feeling of community without the spying. Which is actually a better community, based on trust and respect.</description> <content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or you could make it an event. I won&#8217;t insult you by going into too much detail, but a 10 day countdown before you quite educating them as to why, with special deals and tie-in events at the tasting room. You could also pepper each announcement with links to the ways your peeps can reach you outside of Facebook, like Twitter, your blog, posterous etc.</p><p>You can achieve the same feeling of community without the spying. Which is actually a better community, based on trust and respect.</p> ]]></content:encoded> </item> </channel> </rss>
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